Hurricane Katrina

Zag · Post by **Zag** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 2:13 pm

Lynxa, glad you got out. Barry (www.bcantin.com) lives in Meteirie and he and son evaced but his wife stayed. I still haven't heard form them. *worried*

Baakay · Post by **Baakay** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:22 pm

duotrouble wrote: What was crazy was the gas stations yesterday! We made national news. Some gas stations raised their prices to $5 a gallon.

Aw man!! That's just gouging, pure and simple!!

I heard one of my least favorite human beings (a radio personality) saying "you can't beat the law of supply and demand". Well, dorf, ordinarily I'd agree with you but this is an EMERGENCY SITUATION.

Grrr. I just despise that mind set that wants to look at everything as a business decision, all the time, and has no ability to think about it in any other way. When the people with the demand have absolutely NO supply, nor any way to pay for it, you gotta just eat it a little bit and act like the supreme Christian you claim to be.

Sorry... *ahem* got a little carried away there.

Can you picture how long it's going to take to detoxify this place??!! I lived about 20-30 miles from Love Canal for a few years. More than a decade after it had been officially evacuated and declared a toxic soup zone, they hadn't been able to finish the cleanup.

Nope, the folks that think they're talking about business as usual have NO FREAKING CLUE.

I hope that the Prez's "tour" today encourages him to do more than urge the citizens to behave better. When you're reduced to living like animals, you act like animals. Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs. (except that the animals don't carry firearms

) He needs to move things, NOW, not several weeks from now after raising funds. Bring what's left of the standing army in NOW. They know how to do disaster relief after 9/11.

I'll shut up now. I'm probably echoing what a vast sea of other relatively powerless people are thinking, though, so I won't apologize for being emotional.

glorff · Post by **glorff** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 5:38 pm

There is already an incredible mobilization, but there is so much to do over such a large area.

People need to get out and start their lives over somewhere else, because it will be YEARS before the area is habitable again. Sewer, water and electricity have to be restored(which will take months) No building permits can be issued until then and only after the citys set up government again.

New Orleans should not be rebuilt. At least not at below sea level. Our government in it's infinite wisdom gave these people a false sense of security by letting them build in STUPID locations. This must never happen again. The levees were only engineered for a category three storm, because it was the most cost effective solution. What is wrong with this picture

Baakay · Post by **Baakay** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 6:04 pm

Yeah... I was heartened by the pictures of relief that's getting to places like Biloxi and some of the higher-up yet still seriously damaged towns. The big issue is of course, being able to get a road open...

I heard a colleague say something remarkable today... that there had been money earmarked for improving the levees about 2 years ago, but it got diverted... to the war.

I sure hope that's someone's misunderstanding of the facts. Otherwise... boy. That's just a hard pill to swallow...

monkeyboy · Post by **monkeyboy** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 8:16 pm

Zag wrote:

Barry (www.bcantin.com) lives in Meteirie and he and son evacuated but his wife stayed. I still haven't heard form them. *worried*

I hope she is safe too! And that they are able to get in-touch soon.

With all the services down it must be terrifying for everyone.

Baakay wrote:

I heard a colleague say something remarkable today... that there had been money earmarked for improving the levees about 2 years ago, but it got diverted... to the war.

If thats true it's a disgrace.

Probably more to the fact is the typical differed maintenance that goes on in this country! We don't spend the money to keep up our roads or schools let alone something like a levee.

My heart goes out to the people in MS and AL, but I also hope they don't allow homes to be re-built along the Gulf Coast in the amount they have over the last 35 years.
Or come on, at least not in the same poor design of a slab on the sand!

duotrouble · Post by **duotrouble** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 9:20 pm

Baakay wrote:
duotrouble wrote: What was crazy was the gas stations yesterday! We made national news. Some gas stations raised their prices to $5 a gallon.
Aw man!! That's just gouging, pure and simple!!

Yeah, luckily the governor finally did something about it. I believe his quote was something like . . .

People need to just relax and stay home with their kids.

Uh? Some of us still have to work for a living and don't have kids.

My coworkers and I were talking about New Orleans. I asked how it even really became as big as it is/was. I mean since it's in such a vunerable area. Why would you build levies? Why not just live somewhere you know isn't going to sink?

Now, I've never been to New Orleans. I've always meant to visit and do all the tourist stuff so I have nothing against the city. I've also never wanted to live there. I'm just curious how it came into being. My guess was during the Civil War it was a great strategic place being at the end of the Mississippi River. (I guess this is kinda like asking why live in CA when you know there are earthquakes.)

Lynxa · Post by **Lynxa** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 10:28 pm

Brief history of New Orleans:

New Orleans was founded in 1718 by Jean Baptiste Le Moyne, sieur de Bienville, and named for the regent of France, Philippe II, duc d'Orleans. It remained a French colony until 1763, when it was transferred to the Spanish. In 1800, Spain ceded it back to France; in 1803, New Orleans, along with the entire Louisiana Purchase, was sold by Napoleon I to the United States.

(From http://gatewayno.com/history/new_orleans.html )

So the city of New Orleans is about 12 years shy of 300. The city was and is still a very valuable port for sending barges up the mississippi river. It also has a big petrochemical industry.

As for the levies, they wouldn't be required if the Mississippi were allowed to annually flood its banks like it would in nature, because it would build up its own version of the levies. The Mississippi is heavily dammed along its length now though, so the substitute was built. And also, the levies turned out to be HIGH enough. There was minimal flooding until the levees BROKE. This was because, while most levees are piled up rocks and dirt, the land they are built on is sandy. When inundated with an enormous amount of water over a period of time, this can create a "sand slip", which basically sucks all of the underlying sand out, which drops the levy.

Our govenors have asked the government SEVERAL TIMES (about every time a hurricane heads for us) to reinforce the levy system and every time the government poo poos them.

I also think it's important to realize that this is only the THIRD category 5 hurricanes to hit the US this century. The last one being Camille in 1969. And even then there wasn't devastation on this level. Hindsight is always 20/20 and it's easy to say it's stupid to live in a place where something like that "could" happen, but I don't see people leaving California, Hawaii, and southern Florida en masse either.

Cloud · Post by **Cloud** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 10:28 pm

It goes without saying. I did not know that.

Shampoo · Post by **Shampoo** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 10:45 pm

[glow=red]*Mondo big-oodle glomp to Lynxa*[/glow]

Im so happy you are safe and sound Courtney!

Thou Im so sorry to hear that your house might be among the many in ruins.. ;_; but at the same time, material goods can always be replaced!

Not ppl and loving pets! You evacuated just in time too, looks like a war zone out there at the shelters--yikes!

Im here for ya hon

^_^ if you need anything please dont hesitate to ask!

I haven't been around here too much or have been caught up w/ the news so I had no idea so much was happening elsewhere like Ohio, Mississippi, and Alabama. /wah

I know we've had massive gas shortage out here in Florida, it took me 1 hr to find a gas station tonight, only to pump in 3.20 for regular.

ack!

As for New Orleans levies and what-not, frankly, there are many places that shouldn't have been built but we do it anyways for 1 thing -- profit.

I know around here on westcoast of Florida, we have Condos that were built on sand bars that were man-made and piled up basically sucking up some of the ocean to clear way for construction.

Which is why we evacuate like crazy when hurricanes head for us.

Despite the stupidity of constructin and living so close to the darn ocean, we stay, why? Because our jobs are here, our families are here, etc etc. Same goes w/ all the usual places that come to mind when we think natural disaster.

Every place has its disadvantages whether social or nature: if its not the heavy traffic in NY, its the blizzards in Maine and Mass., or the flooding in Ohio, or the tornadoes in Kansas, hurricanes in Florida, heat-waves in Arizona and Nevada... no place essentially is safe. We just have to make do and live side by side w/ a very pissed of mother nature (but can you blame her? look how well we treat our enviroment T_T )

BTW you forgot Hurricane Andrew, he was a 5.

klet · Post by **klet** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 11:42 pm

Shampoo wrote:heat-waves in Arizona and Nevada

At least we can go inside and hang out in the air conditioning--or at least the majority of us can. There are always people who cannot afford to have some sort of cooling in their homes.

But what is so devastating about the hurricane is that it hit such a vast area. Hopefully those affected can get the relief they need soon.

I'm not sure if it's because of the hurricane, but we got rain here in Arizona today. /wah

Usually our rain comes from the western side of Mexico, but if today was a direct result of Katrina, it's a true testament to how amazingly powerful the storm really was.

On a lighter note:

kymaera wrote:
Not Sir Phobos wrote:You would kill me for a beach!
No. I would have you killed off for a beach (or fjord). There is a slight difference

Now there's an idea.

kymaera and I could go to the beach. But I'd need to get a plushie-sized swimsuit.

duotrouble · Post by **duotrouble** » Fri Sep 02, 2005 12:05 am

Thanks, Lynxa, for the brief history lesson.

I knew it was originally settled by the French and part of the Louisiana purchase. I was just curious how it became such a large city. But you did reinforce my idea that it's all due to the muddy miss.

I totally agree with you, shampoo! I've always said you have to deal with some kind of natural disaster no matter where you live. I've lived through practically all of them at some point already in my life. I choose the coastline with it's hurricanes and tornadoes. Why? Because when there aren't hurricanes and tornadoes, it's my kind of weather.

I feel so helpless in earthquakes. So while many times I've thought about moving to LA, I just never have.

It really does suck that everyone seems in it for the almighty dollar and not common sense anymore. But then again, I've made the comment myself a few times too. If I didn't have to work, I wouldn't. I'm in it for the almighty dollar.

Makoli · Post by **Makoli** » Fri Sep 02, 2005 12:26 am

in all my years of life i have never had to deal with natural disasters of any sort, well other then rain storms. if theres a god in heaven i hope he still hears my prayers for ya'll

Baakay · Post by **Baakay** » Fri Sep 02, 2005 6:26 am

Shampoo wrote:[ Every place has its disadvantages whether social or nature: if its not the heavy traffic in NY, its the blizzards in Maine and

Aww heck... Maine's equipped for blizzards, that's nothing.

What's really challenging is: blackfly season

Klet... the rain in AZ was yer basic monsoon flow, I think. Or leftovers from the front that helped push Katrina east.

As to why New Orleans... All of the largest places on the planet started for one reason, plain and simple -- the geography. Spots that were near water, food, and building materials (wood, or stuff to make adobe, or...) got settled first. And if it was a particularly beautiful place to boot, all the better. Basically, you have to make a "living" first, even if we're talking hunt-and-gather.

I remember watching Carl Sagan talking about global warming maybe... 20 years ago now? And thinking, "his billions and billions of stars have finally warped his mind." The maps he showed--of places that would likely be destroyed in the event of continued global warming and ocean rise--were so incredibly extreme that I couldn't IMAGINE them being realistic. And lo and behold, he was right... I should have known better.

Hee... can you tell I'm a closet weather/geography geek?

I would have gone that direction educationally except that when I was a kid girls did English, History, or Elementary Ed. Boys did science. Blah. It still makes a great passtime, though.

kisara · Post by **kisara** » Fri Sep 02, 2005 6:34 am

Okay. I have but just one question. . .

I love New Orleans. The history, the mystery. . dunno that you'll find a city with more character in the country. It was the entire reason I took French in high school. I was gonna move to Orleans, learn some voodoo and a little cajun. But that's another story for another day. I just wanna know. . .

What genius decided to establish a settlement right next to the sea on a location BELOW sea-level?! O_O

Anyhoo. . . this has plagued me for some time.

Zag · Post by **Zag** » Fri Sep 02, 2005 7:46 am

Shampoo wrote: I haven't been around here too much or have been caught up w/ the news so I had no idea so much was happening elsewhere like Ohio, Mississippi, and Alabama.

Nani, nani!? Ohio?! What's going on here? What did I miss?
*lives in Columbus, Ohio*